Complete Fibre, CTG & Openreach

[MatrixOptics]

Hi, my apartment complex has Orbit housing as the owner/landlord and they got CTG to install Fibre throughout to our doors about 3 years ago but we still can't get FTTP with anyone.

Reading through news articles and a thread on this forum, it seems like CTG install it for Orbit and then up to 4 isps can connect to the fibre. Due to having to rent the Fibre, no isps', including the ones they partnered with want to pay the rental for using their fibre.

After a long complaint process Orbit are telling me that Openreach is looking to connect to the CTG fibre so fibre can be offered here. That doesn't sound right to me but thought I would ask the more knowledgeable people here if that is likely or not If so, how would I contact Openreach to chase this?

Any help or insights would be greatly appreciated!

 

[meritez]

CTG Withdraws Services from the UK Fibre Market After Slowdown

The Milton Keynes-based Complete Technology Group (CTG), which is a UK landlord advisory service that also runs Complete Fibre (i.e. they install full fibre bro

www.ispreview.co.uk

There's a comment with a contact email address but Openreach would not use someone else's stuff but would deploy their own fibre.

also found:

Thread 'Does anyone have any experience with Complete Fibre and CTG?'

Jun 3, 2024

I live in a relatively new block of flats (built around 2016) in London and, despite living in an inner London borough, I’m stuck with FTTC broadband. After years of silence, my housing association agreed a deal with a company called Complete Technology Group (CTG) to bring a service called Complete Fibre to my block of flats.

This service preinstalls the connections needed for fibre to the premises, making it plug and play for ISPs. Unfortunately, the costs get passed onto the telecommunications companies, which might explain why no local ISP has attempted to use this service. Complete...

• JambaJOOCE
• Replies: 19
• Forum: General Discussion

• 

 

[plunet]

From an broadband infrastructure provider's point of view, the shared fibre is a point of failure between their network and their customer over which they do not have control, and they don't like this arrangement. They are unable to offer any SLA to their ONT and it makes their service non-standard.

What landlords should do if anything is provide a little wall space at the building entry, an approved cabling path from there and shared containment if necessary to each floor or resident unit as necessary, with a canned method statement which includes any fire stopping requirements. This is all something that is readily accepted as part of a wayleave agreement, and causes no friction provided it's reasonable.

Shared building fibre isn't the way to go unfortunately.

 

[meritez]

@MatrixOptics
Other stuff, who paid for this to be installed?

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/siteassets/resources/documents/consultations/category-3-4-weeks/235933-code-powers-to-complete-technology-group-limited/associated-documents/code-powers-complete-technology-group-limited.pdf?v=327792

COMPLETE TECHNOLOGY SOLUTIONS LIMITED overview - Find and update company information - GOV.UK

COMPLETE TECHNOLOGY SOLUTIONS LIMITED - Free company information from Companies House including registered office address, filing history, accounts, annual return, officers, charges, business activity

find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk

website and companies house registered address no longer match up:

The new way to install Full Fibre infrastructure - Complete Fibre

Full-fibre infrastructure in MDUs We’re not an ISP – We are a digital fibre infrastructure specialist working on behalf of landlords, providing telcos with quicker and safer access to buildings. With a single installation, our

www.thecompletefibre.com

 

[MatrixOptics]

Thats basically what I thought.

I have sent an email to that contact on the other post but previous attempts to contact them were ignored so I don't hold up much hope.

Orbit don't seem to know certain bits from their elbow so it's frustrating not getting anywhere with them either. It would be nice if I could go back to them and say Openreach definitely are not looking to connect to CTGs fibre and find out how they or other companies can cable the building but I'm sure there is some kind of exclusivity deal which means we might never get FTTP here despite having the cabling for 2 years already

 

[MatrixOptics]

CTG Is Delighted To Be Appointed By The Orbit Group | Complete Technology Group

CTG has signed a service agreement with Orbit to deliver fibre to the home

completetechnologygroup.com

This article says CTG entered in to a service agreement with Orbit in 2021

 

[MatrixOptics]

@MatrixOptics
Other stuff, who paid for this to be installed?

I assume Orbit paid. Unless there was some agreement where they do it free or very cheap so they can make the money off The rental of the last part of the network.

To be honest I'm not sure how to find out. It took me 3 months of asking + an official complaint with Orbit to get to the point where they told me OpenReach is looking to connect to CTGs fibre

 

[meritez]

Orbit don't seem to know certain bits from their elbow so it's frustrating not getting anywhere with them either.

If Orbit have advised Openreach are looking at wiring you up, then it would be worth contacting Openreach, no carrier will use CTG's infrastructure as they do not maintain or manage it. As you would need an Optical Network Terminal installed in to your property, Openreach would not connect that to someone else's fibre infrastructure.

have you checked https://bidb.uk/ for any other network provider locally?

 

[mwarby]

I also note CTG do much if it for 'free' the idea presumably being that say Openreach would then pay them for each customer on an ongoing basis.

The actual networks for reasons pointed out above would sooner control it all

One issue that springs to mind. Say Openreach and virgin both sign up to CTG, and there is some confusion around which fibre is which. Could easily result in an unexpected disconnection. Also who's allowed to do the patching, what if an ISP damages another ISPs kit etc.

Much easier to have each network control thier stuff end to end, with the expectation that nobody other thier techs touch it

 

[candlerb]

Not a great business plan though - to install this internal fibre without having any agreements in place with suppliers to use it.

 

[mwarby]

Unless they have some kind of exclusivity arrangement.

 

[JambaJOOCE]

It's interesting to read your experience and how it basically mirrors everything I'm going through, except you're with a different housing association to me.

I only recently found out that Riverside (my housing association) isn't in an exclusive contract with CTG, so they are allowed to give ISPs permission to build on our premises. However, Riverside also says they must review every building request to ensure it "aligns with our responsibilities around building compliance, health and safety, and the long-term integrity of the property". Of course, this seems like a load of rubbish considering many other buildings in the surrounding area have managed to install fibre services very easily.

Please let me know how you get on with your situation. I've gone through years of back and forth emails with Riverside only to end up no better off.

 

[mwarby]

Health and safety could relate to asbestos or fire concerns. 'long term integrity' id guess it's code for the don't want the outside covered in cables and peppered with holes

 

[MatrixOptics]

In an unexpected turn of events, this morning I received a reply from the hello@ email at CTG. The content surprised me & may surprise you too. If correct, maybe there is hope for others including JambaJooce

Openreach have confirmed that they will be connecting to your building, but at the moment I'm afraid I don't have a date for you. As soon as we get notification we will let you and other residents know.

 

[JambaJOOCE]

In an unexpected turn of events, this morning I received a reply from the hello@ email at CTG. The content surprised me & may surprise you too. If correct, maybe there is hope for others including JambaJooce

They've been saying the same thing to me for months now, and only recently did they confirm to me that Openreach will connect to Complete Fibre before the end of 2026. This really irritated me as they implied we would be connected much sooner, that's why I've asked my housing association to opt for something different.

 

[MatrixOptics]

They've been saying the same thing to me for months now, and only recently did they confirm to me that Openreach will connect to Complete Fibre before the end of 2026. This really irritated me as they implied we would be connected much sooner, that's why I've asked my housing association to opt for something different.

That's annoying. Im in the situation that if I sign up for a new contract for FTTC now, I can half my bill but obviously don't want to be stuck in a contract if FTTP is just around the corner.

At the same time, I don't want to be stuck paying double the bill for a year if it will take that long.

When I checked the Bidb site recommended above it said Openreach have no plans for FTTP for my postcode. It's a shame there seems to be no way to contact Openreach for clarification for end users

 

[meritez]

That's annoying. Im in the situation that if I sign up for a new contract for FTTC now, I can half my bill but obviously don't want to be stuck in a contract if FTTP is just around the corner.

At the same time, I don't want to be stuck paying double the bill for a year if it will take that long.

When I checked the Bidb site recommended above it said Openreach have no plans for FTTP for my postcode. It's a shame there seems to be no way to contact Openreach for clarification for end users

Broadband for landlords

Openreach's Full Fibre broadband for landlords can equip your property with high-speed connectivity whilst satisfying tenants and boosting demand.

www.openreach.com

Ask them to fill in the form, raise at your next residents meeting for everyone to sign up for updates.

 

[plunet]

However, Riverside also says they must review every building request to ensure it "aligns with our responsibilities around building compliance, health and safety, and the long-term integrity of the property". Of course, this seems like a load of rubbish considering many other buildings in the surrounding area have managed to install fibre services very easily.

I suggest that as a resident you should expect your managing agent or landlord to say exactly what has been stated above.

Inappropriate cable installation methods can turn cable paths and spaces like risers into chimneys that are very very effective at spreading fire through a building at great speed, rather than containing it.

They're just saying there's some checks and balances they will need to do review the planned works to be done by the installer, maybe a pre-works site meeting, condition photos in relevant areas taken before work starts, and then probably another site meeting one after the installation and checking that the works are up to standard, meet fire regulations, that no unexpected damage has occurred. Their wording doesn't imply that they're going to be obstructive although it's hard to know what will happen in practice.

You should be concerned if Riverside were not going to do things like this to protect not only the interests of the landlord but also the safety of the residents such as yourself.

 

[JambaJOOCE]

I suggest that as a resident you should expect your managing agent or landlord to say exactly what has been stated above.

Inappropriate cable installation methods can turn cable paths and spaces like risers into chimneys that are very very effective at spreading fire through a building at great speed, rather than containing it.

They're just saying there's some checks and balances they will need to do review the planned works to be done by the installer, maybe a pre-works site meeting, condition photos in relevant areas taken before work starts, and then probably another site meeting one after the installation and checking that the works are up to standard, meet fire regulations, that no unexpected damage has occurred. Their wording doesn't imply that they're going to be obstructive although it's hard to know what will happen in practice.

You should be concerned if Riverside were not going to do things like this to protect not only the interests of the landlord but also the safety of the residents such as yourself.

Oh yeah, I completely agree, I'm glad they're being careful as to not risk another cladding-style situation like we've seen with other flats around the UK. With that being said, I do think they're being overly precautious, essentially using this as an excuse to forbid any ISP from building on the property. My flat is no stranger to random works taking place without any warning whatsoever, so it just seems a bit strange.

 

[bon]

My friend lives in an MDU of 17 apartments and only has access to 10Mb ADSL. No local FTTP operator is interested in providing service (I've contacted all of them over the years) and so his Internet is served by flakey high-latency 5G. Annoyingly there's both a Toob and Openreach manifold directly outside his block on a street pole but obviously cannot be used for his address.

CTG recently dropped a letter through his door announcing their intention to cable up the building and when I've queried with them who the ISP will be, they mentioned Openreach.

I'm curious to know how others have got on with the next step after Phase 1 i.e procurement of an ISP because it does seem like most of the time the process stalls after the fibre is put in. Understandably my friend is quite excited at the prospect of a decent landline connection but I feel l should probably temper his expectations if this thread is anything to go by.