When you ask a supervisor why they didn’t report something, and they say, ‘Because I didn’t want to lose my job’—that’s a safety system problem.” James Junkin, MS, CSP, MSP, SMP, ASP, CSHO In this week’s new episode of The Risk Matrix Podcast, James shares a field story from early in his career—responding to a catastrophic steel mill explosion where miscommunication, fear, and silence had deadly consequences. Alongside Dr. Logan F. Martin, PhD, MBA, PMP, CIH, CSP, CHMM, they discuss: • The difference between accountability and blame • Why punitive policies don’t prevent incidents • What safety leaders must do to foster trust in the system 🎧 Episode 107: Accountability or Blame? Safety Investigations and the No-Blame Debate Now available on: YouTube: https://lnkd.in/gAchY7xx Spotify: https://lnkd.in/grDXi4x6 Apple: https://lnkd.in/gsqpxQDp

Franklin Shanks, MBA, MS, CSP

(Husband to 1, Father to 4) Strategic HSE leader and educator bringing safety to the forefront.

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The question was asked, “Is blame the same as accountability? Is accountability the same as blame? Is there room for some piece of blame to the worker in a system or are we going to holdfast to one idea”? Blame is not the same as accountability. Blame points the finger and is destructive, while accountability acknowledges responsibility and is constructive. There is no room for blame but there is room for accountability in a system with employees at all levels. Accountability does not mean zero discipline. A company should not punish mistakes. When mistakes become repetitive it evolves away from punishment into a competency issue and the worker may not have the mental or emotional capacity for the job. Point being is that a company should not tolerate intentional deviations and discipline accordingly but not punish mistakes. Repetative mistakes after all other avenues to develop the employee have been explored may result in termination. I’ve always been in the camp of taking the best from BBS, HOP and System Safety and combining them to what works in the organization. James made a great point. “There is no safety management system for I don’t care” that is the greatest challenge we as safety professionals face.

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